Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

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Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby J349 » 08 Dec 2014, 19:23

Eye-opening...

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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby OzBiggles1963 » 09 Dec 2014, 06:58

Very interesting...& a sobering thought to realise that over 2,000 nuclear explosions have occurred between 1945-1998 [I am assuming the Youtube uploader did not document any beyond this point in time?]. I know there were quite a few experiments conducted in South Australia [at Maralinga] in the 1950's. I am not a believer in or proponent of nuclear energy, owing to the many fission accidents, horrendous radiation & 'near misses' that have occurred over the years, caused mainly by human error [many of which have not been made publicly known unfortunately]. Most people would be hard pressed to name more than 3 power plant accidents [i.e. Three Mile Island, Chernobyl & the more recent Fukushima disaster in 2011], but there have been apparently 99 in total since 1952, according to the 'definitions' given by the International Atomic Energy Agency:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_an ... _incidents
They've been working together for so long that each seems to know by a sort of telepathy when another is in trouble. One never seems to get them together. Get one & the others come after him. To give the devil his due they make a formidable team.
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby tiffinata » 09 Dec 2014, 10:26

Frightening on both counts.
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby OzBiggles1963 » 09 Dec 2014, 11:01

tiffinata wrote:Frightening on both counts.


And before I get on my soapbox, don't even start me on 'deep geological repositories' for nuclear waste...what a giant hoax, blight on the environment & absolute rubbish the general public are told regarding the so-called safety measures taken for 'spent nuclear' [we are peddled so many untruths that nuclear energy is supposed to be clean energy...nonsense I say!]. There are so many countries where this waste is buried, to be forgotten for up to a million years in some cases:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deep_geological_repository
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby SaintedAunt » 09 Dec 2014, 12:38

They currently take spent nuclear stuff from nearby Sizewell (and I mean nearby - no chance of running if it blows up) and take it by train to Thorpe (Seascale, Cumbria, at the other end of the country) which I used to look at across the Irish Sea from the IoM. I do agree with you OzB.
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby Fairblue » 09 Dec 2014, 12:54

I once went for a job at the Hinckley Nuclear Power Plant in Somerset I was asked if I minded "sitting" on what was in effect a nuclear bomb. My answer, if I recall, was that I thought I'd rather be sitting on it as I would then know nothing about it if it did go off.
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby SaintedAunt » 09 Dec 2014, 14:56

Fairblue wrote:I once went for a job at the Hinckley Nuclear Power Plant in Somerset I was asked if I minded "sitting" on what was in effect a nuclear bomb. My answer, if I recall, was that I thought I'd rather be sitting on it as I would then know nothing about it if it did go off.

I'm with you there :)
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby kylie_koyote » 09 Dec 2014, 15:15

Fairblue wrote:I once went for a job at the Hinckley Nuclear Power Plant in Somerset I was asked if I minded "sitting" on what was in effect a nuclear bomb. My answer, if I recall, was that I thought I'd rather be sitting on it as I would then know nothing about it if it did go off.

:lol: :lol:

I saw a comedy sketch just the other day where a man is sitting in a coffee shop, preparing to put artificial sweetener and fat-free milk into his coffee. In the far distance, a mushroom cloud blots out the sun. While everyone else in the coffee shop is running around screaming and sobbing hysterically, the man reaches for the real sugar and the real cream instead.
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby Kismet » 09 Dec 2014, 15:24

I live about 6 miles from a nuclear power station. My husband and ninety percent of the people I know work there. I brought three children up in its shadow. Doesn't bother me at all. Its safety record is absolutely excellent compared to that of the mines: hundreds of people round here died in mining accidents, including, historically, well over 100 children, and thousands had long term health issues from going down the mines.

No contest.
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby J349 » 09 Dec 2014, 16:15

Yeah certainly safer than the mines. Plus I think it's more renewable as you can use different substances for nuclear fission (although it is fairly non-renewable atm) than oil, gas or coal.
In the UK, solar energy is ineffective - we get very little sun over here! Wind powered turbines are pretty much useless. And gas, oil and coal don't last forever.
I'd invest more in nuclear energy, it's a lot safer than people assume - only been 3 incidents in the UK with no casualties according to wikipedia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_n ... ed_Kingdom
Last edited by J349 on 09 Dec 2014, 16:31, edited 1 time in total.
Petroffsky beamed. 'Now you may be certain of seeing me soon,' he declared. 'Au revoir. Remember, my rifle is at your command.'
'And my chocolate is at yours,' returned Biggles, smiling. 'Goodbye for now.'
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby Kismet » 09 Dec 2014, 16:24

Don't start me on wind turbines. They've stuck them on every hill round here and you can't drive anywhere without seeing them mainly fail to turn: too calm, too windy, the man hasn't been to mend them from last time... Also the tidal currents are washing away all the foundations from the ones in the Solway Estuary (also visible from where I live).

The ones on the Industrial Park fit in quite well. I don't mind them in an urban environment.
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby J349 » 09 Dec 2014, 16:33

Kismet wrote:Don't start me on wind turbines. They've stuck them on every hill round here and you can't drive anywhere without seeing them mainly fail to turn: too calm, too windy, the man hasn't been to mend them from last time... Also the tidal currents are washing away all the foundations from the ones in the Solway Estuary (also visible from where I live).

The ones on the Industrial Park fit in quite well. I don't mind them in an urban environment.

Nuclear power stations, wind turbines, you sure do live in a energetic part of the country!
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby Kismet » 09 Dec 2014, 16:39

J349 wrote:
Kismet wrote:Don't start me on wind turbines. They've stuck them on every hill round here and you can't drive anywhere without seeing them mainly fail to turn: too calm, too windy, the man hasn't been to mend them from last time... Also the tidal currents are washing away all the foundations from the ones in the Solway Estuary (also visible from where I live).

The ones on the Industrial Park fit in quite well. I don't mind them in an urban environment.

Nuclear power stations, wind turbines, you sure do live in a energetic part of the country!

No where's perfect. I really like living where I do, but there are occasional drawbacks.
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby SaintedAunt » 09 Dec 2014, 18:03

J349 wrote:Yeah certainly safer than the mines.

That is historical. In this day and age I should think they could mine coal using robots if they put money into research. And build clean coal-burning power stations. Would tide us over...
In the UK, solar energy is ineffective - we get very little sun over here! Wind powered turbines are pretty much useless

This is not true. Existing wind turbines can already provide up to 10% of UK electricity. It's just that it is variable and needs storage systems to even out the supply. You don't need sun for solar power either - just UV and that is always present, even in winter. That's why there is a growing number of solar farms and maybe in future, solar panels incorporated into rooftops automatically.
I'd invest more in nuclear energy, it's a lot safer than people assume - only been 3 incidents in the UK with no casualties according to wikipedia

Put not your trust in Wikipedia!!! the Winscale fire in 1957 was serious, and it was fortunate that there were no deaths directly attributable to it. I could tell you a tale about monitoring upland sheep in Cumbria (contaminated grass from Chernobyl dust rained down on the fells in 1986; they were still monitoring it when I left Cumbria in 2003 and they only stopped in 2012). And that was over a thousand miles away. It's not just the safety of UK nuclear power stations, but those in France, Belgium, Holland,… and other less-reliable parts of the world. We are a small country - just think what might happen if there were a serious nuclear accident within, let us say, a couple of hundred miles of the UK.

And your generation, J349, ought to be worrying about the nuclear waste that my thoughtless generation has left for you to inherit. And if you have any spare capacity for worrying after that, there is nuclear terrorism. I live less than 4 miles from Sizewell nuclear power station and trains go from there to the far side of England (Suffolk to West Cumbria) to the Thorpe reprocessing plant. Trains!!! I sometimes wonder if that is why we see so many military helicopters round here.
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby J349 » 09 Dec 2014, 18:30

SaintedAunt wrote:
J349 wrote:Yeah certainly safer than the mines.

That is historical. In this day and age I should think they could mine coal using robots if they put money into research. And build clean coal-burning power stations. Would tide us over...
In the UK, solar energy is ineffective - we get very little sun over here! Wind powered turbines are pretty much useless

This is not true. Existing wind turbines can already provide up to 10% of UK electricity. It's just that it is variable and needs storage systems to even out the supply. You don't need sun for solar power either - just UV and that is always present, even in winter. That's why there is a growing number of solar farms and maybe in future, solar panels incorporated into rooftops automatically.
I'd invest more in nuclear energy, it's a lot safer than people assume - only been 3 incidents in the UK with no casualties according to wikipedia

Put not your trust in Wikipedia!!! the Winscale fire in 1957 was serious, and it was fortunate that there were no deaths directly attributable to it. I could tell you a tale about monitoring upland sheep in Cumbria (contaminated grass from Chernobyl dust rained down on the fells in 1986; they were still monitoring it when I left Cumbria in 2003 and they only stopped in 2012). And that was over a thousand miles away. It's not just the safety of UK nuclear power stations, but those in France, Belgium, Holland,… and other less-reliable parts of the world. We are a small country - just think what might happen if there were a serious nuclear accident within, let us say, a couple of hundred miles of the UK.


I'll have to hand it to you - i'm no scientist or expert on the subject!
Just there's been a lot of talk in the press about how wind farms/solar farms are inefficient for the money put into them, so much in developing them. I don't have any links to hand to back it up; just going on my opinion built up over time through what I hear and see. I must admit I'm no environmentalist, and think the whole green thing is a bit of a con, but there we are..
SaintedAunt wrote:And your generation, J349, ought to be worrying about the nuclear waste that my thoughtless generation has left for you to inherit. And if you have any spare capacity for worrying after that, there is nuclear terrorism. I live less than 4 miles from Sizewell nuclear power station and trains go from there to the far side of England (Suffolk to West Cumbria) to the Thorpe reprocessing plant. Trains!!! I sometimes wonder if that is why we see so many military helicopters round here.

There's lots of potential targets in that case. A far better/easier one (IMO) for a terrorist would be the shipwreck filled with explosives in the Thames Estuary, apparently one explosion there would do a ton of damage and kill thousands. I'd imagine security at nuclear power stations is pretty high comparatively (although the MoD are quite tight around this area). I appreciate power stations are much bigger (and potentially more deadly) targets though.

I'd certainly be in favour of green renewable energy if it was effective enough, but the whole wind farm thing hasn't really paid off (to my mind anyway), at least from what I've heard. This one is only an opinion but I think there's some truth in it: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/colu ... -scam.html
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby SaintedAunt » 09 Dec 2014, 18:45

J349 wrote:... I must admit I'm no environmentalist, and think the whole green thing is a bit of a con…

I am shocked. Really genuinely shocked. I trust the rest of your generation doesn't think like you. If it does, I shall stop worrying about your nuclear waste inheritance…
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby Kismet » 09 Dec 2014, 18:53

It's a generational backlash thing I think, SA. My generation was all about joining CND and Greenpeace in our teens so the current generation can't possibly be that uncool (do something our parents did!). The ones I know seem to be developing awarenesses of issues as they leave home and attend universities, but they are not the same issues that were dominant in our thinking.
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby J349 » 09 Dec 2014, 19:01

SaintedAunt wrote:
J349 wrote:... I must admit I'm no environmentalist, and think the whole green thing is a bit of a con…

I am shocked. Really genuinely shocked. I trust the rest of your generation doesn't think like you. If it does, I shall stop worrying about your nuclear waste inheritance…

There's too many green people around, to worry about a stray rogue like me :lol:
I do my recycling (although a lot of that gets transported to Indian dump sites apparently).

I love the country though, I'm all for preserving it - just think we're barking up the wrong tree with 'climate change' and green energy (to an extent anyway). I put it down to the invention of plastic; very wasteful society these days.

Kismet wrote:It's a generational backlash thing I think, SA. My generation was all about joining CND and Greenpeace in our teens so the current generation can't possibly be that uncool (do something our parents did!). The ones I know seem to be developing awarenesses of issues as they leave home and attend universities, but they are not the same issues that were dominant in our thinking.

Not sure about that, I was of the opinion that most people (of the previous generation) were against it/not bothered - certainly everybody around me thinks/thought that way?
I'd say, people are more likely to follow their parents footsteps?
It's what they teach you in schools - green stuff, climate change, etc. that probably makes them think this way?
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby SaintedAunt » 09 Dec 2014, 19:06

I am curious to know (1) whereabouts in the UK you live, as you would appear to have no sun and uncaring un-green previous-generation people all round you and (2) do you never use plastic then?

The problem wasn't the invention of plastic (for want of a better term, although it's akin to the term classical music) it was that they didn't invent biodegradable plastic :(
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby J349 » 09 Dec 2014, 19:30

SaintedAunt wrote:I am curious to know (1) whereabouts in the UK you live, as you would appear to have no sun and uncaring un-green previous-generation people all round you and (2) do you never use plastic then?

The problem wasn't the invention of plastic (for want of a better term, although it's akin to the term classical music) it was that they didn't invent biodegradable plastic :(

Woah, don't come at me with all your sciencey stuff! technical language :?

I wouldn't say I don't care or that the people around me don't care. I live in Kent, and my connections are not some sort of secret anti-green society. We have quite a lot of sun actually, and quite a few people nearby have solar panels on their roof (that work well).
I genuinely just think there is a case for not spending the nation's budget on wind turbines that aren't as effective as they are supposed to be (that's what i've heard), or combating 'climate change'; I think you'll find that a lot of people view these things on similar lines; there is certainly a fair bit of evidence for thinking so.
I repeat i'm not against 'green' things, i'm all for it; I just think people are tackling the wrong type of green things; it's the 21st century mindset that needs to change as much as anything.
In lots of ways I'd happily go back in time and live 50 years ago; although admittedly each generation has its problems... Lol what am I rambling on about? :D
I'm amazed how nuclear bombs have blown up into a debate about green energy lol. Anyway i'm procrastinating and there's work to be done.. see you later!
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby SaintedAunt » 09 Dec 2014, 19:44

It's easy to belittle what is done but far harder to produce alternative workable suggestions.
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby Fairblue » 09 Dec 2014, 19:48

J349 wrote:I'm amazed how nuclear bombs have blown up into a debate about green energy lol. Anyway i'm procrastinating and there's work to be done.. see you later!

Don't be amazed, it happens all the time here. And, as you work your way through all the topics of the forum that you haven't yet read you will find that the progression ftom one topic to another is completely logical. ;)
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby SaintedAunt » 09 Dec 2014, 19:50

Fairblue wrote:
J349 wrote:I'm amazed how nuclear bombs have blown up into a debate about green energy lol. Anyway i'm procrastinating and there's work to be done.. see you later!

Don't be amazed, it happens all the time here. And, as you work your way through all the topics of the forum that you haven't yet read you will find that the progression ftom one topic to another is completely logical. ;)

That's right - any minute now we could be discussing cake-baking… :twisted:
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby J349 » 09 Dec 2014, 20:07

SaintedAunt wrote:It's easy to belittle what is done but far harder to produce alternative workable suggestions.

Yeah definitely agree with you there, I was trying to think of a better way back there but couldn't. Sometimes the best solution is just to scrap it all, if it's of no or limited use - scrap it, there are far better things the money can be spent on.
I think we entered the wind turbine market too early, now we're the laughing stock :lol: :oops:
The problem is our government's so steeped in greed, bribery and fraud that most of what they do is just to please/silence the public or press. No good motives behind it all; lies - like with the recycling going off to India...absolutely no honesty about, nobody will admit their mistakes; all the result of crooked man.
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'And my chocolate is at yours,' returned Biggles, smiling. 'Goodbye for now.'
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby tiffinata » 09 Dec 2014, 22:18

Pandora's Box? ;)
Many of the debates over here about renewable energy vs coal are driven by big companies and appear to be all geared in favour of a big few. These people get the tax breaks and have the ear of the govenment. Our renewable energy industry is effectively dead- Many of the rebates for solar installation were scrapped so why put them on your house? When you have them feeding back into the grid, great! But when you buy eneergy from the grid your base rate is much higher, so the big companies get you anyway.
I'm sure a fair proportion of Australia's recycling goes to India as well, where some poor person picks out what is salvageable for $1 /week.
Some of Melbourne's recycling ends up in landfill. Much of it is through ingnorance. The council I work for runs education campaigns, tours, anything to get the message across.(we won awards for it too!)

There's very little investment in science and technology. What we need are smarter ways to do things, without loss of our current quality of life. Are you in a position (and can you afford) to buy green power? When you fly do you take up the option of a carbon offset? One person doing something can make a difference.

Climate change is real. For a while I wondered myself, but I can see the direct impact in the garden I work in- more severe weather events, prolonged dryness, plants dying that we could grow perfectly well, new species we hadn't been able to grow in the hundred years the garden had existed, plants suddenly becoming weeds.


As first world countries we have created most of the mess, its up to us to sort it out because of the impact it is having on third world countries, where people are starving to death because of drought, or being washed away by massive mudslides.
'....you cannot flout Nature with impunity. Treat Nature with respect, and she will tolerate you, even encourage you; but treat her with contempt, and your days are numbered.' Hits the Trail
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Re: Time-Lapse Map of Every Nuclear Explosion Since 1945

Postby OzBiggles1963 » 10 Dec 2014, 02:07

Kismet wrote:I live about 6 miles from a nuclear power station. My husband and ninety percent of the people I know work there. I brought three children up in its shadow. Doesn't bother me at all. Its safety record is absolutely excellent compared to that of the mines: hundreds of people round here died in mining accidents, including, historically, well over 100 children, and thousands had long term health issues from going down the mines.

No contest.


I agree with you that many nuclear plants are run 'safely' etc as per guidelines set down [& certainly kill less people working inside than the history of the mining industry would show], but the potential for harm or what we call 'near misses' in the occupational health & safety industry is what scares me, as many are unreported:

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/ ... clearpower

If it wasn't for human nature, wear & tear, & many other factors, mostly economic by nature imho [including the use of old nuclear reactors in Japan with less safety features than modern models] many would indeed be safer around the world. But it's not the plants, or the fission material used, I have a 'beef' with, it's how this material is disposed [ignored really] that shows a complete lack of disregard for the future. No matter how many other 'green' arguments are presented about coal, wind, solar powered or whatever [many are not suitable for some countries as has been correctly pointed out], the fact remains that nuclear waste is 'untreatable' & going to lie around in the environment for up to a million yrs. To my rational mind, this completely & irrevocably outweighs any arguments claiming it's inherent 'clean' value...nonsensical really.

Here's an article I read [following the Fukushima disaster] which outlines why the GE 'Mark 1' reactors are faulty, dangerous & should have been retired decades ago [I believe they date back to the 60's, & amongst other factors, have less safety features, thinner concrete walls etc etc]:

http://www.globalresearch.ca/fukushima- ... ma/5361300

But the argument remains, no system is perfect for every country, resources are not used sensibly & equally across nations, shortcuts are taken, & as Tiff pointed out, big business corporations have their interests at heart & skew all the data in their favour [am I a conspiracy theorist? Yep! ;) :mrgreen: ]. Anyway, enough of my rant, I just worry for the future of our planet & what our children are left with. No wonder they may indeed end up more cynical than us. :)

As George Orwell said [??] "“Every generation imagines itself to be more intelligent than the one that went before it, and wiser than the one that comes after it.”
Guilty as charged... 8-)

P.S. We have solar power panels [installed before the rebates were reduced] & since we use less than a single household, are able to put back a lot into the grid & receive a yearly rebate put back into our bank a/c. Not everyone is in a position to do this, however we get a lot of sunshine here, when it's not thunderstorms & hail, as of late, lol.
They've been working together for so long that each seems to know by a sort of telepathy when another is in trouble. One never seems to get them together. Get one & the others come after him. To give the devil his due they make a formidable team.
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